Book Chat 23: Lisa Mannetti/The Gentling Box
January, 2010Dave F. said...
The Gentling Box is not what I expected.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Dave, what were you expecting?
Dave
F. said...Maybe more paranormal and less horror. I know that doesn't
sound logical but it's like you don't look at all like your voice
sounded.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Dave, I'm not sure what you mean...
sylvia
said...It was somehow not at all what I expected either. I somehow
hadn't realised it was horror fantasy (is that a genre?)
Lisa_Mannetti said...I never thought of it as horror fantasy...more like literary horror, but that's an interesting take.
Robin S. said...I never thought about the genre of literary horror until recently, and I like it.
Evil Editor said...The best literary horror comes from small presses.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Yes, it's mostly small presses putting out literary horror.
Xiexie said...I agree with the horror fantasy moniker.
Robin
S. said...To me, the best literary horror (and I do count some of
Stephen King here) is introspective, at least in places. That's what I
liked about yours as well. Lisa.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Thanks,
Robin...I really despise books that are "popcorn" in any genre--getting
inside the character is key for me--in films, too.
sylvia said...That was good in a way though, because I shared Imre's sense of disbelief.
Lisa_Mannetti said...I'm glad you identified with Imre.
sylvia
said...I guess I expected something more typically classic - gypsies
and Dracula and evil nearby. Evil within us thus caught me unawares. I
was pulled in from the start, hoping with Imre that sanity would
prevail.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Oh, no, never typical...that wouldn't be any fun for me or for readers!
Dave
F. said...I usually pass any novel that I read on to my relatives,
mostly my mother who's in her late 80's. I don't think she will read
this one.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Yeah, might be rough--although my mother read it as a ms before it was published and she loved it.
Evil Editor said...Anyeta: among the most horrible characters of all time. Which I mean in a good way.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Anyeta was a boat load of fun to write!
Evil Editor said...Those who would want to be friends with Anyeta, raise your hand . . . the one you didn't cut off.
Xiexie said...*Raises hand* I found Anyeta delightfully evil. She was truly despicable and sad too though.
Judy said...I loved Anyeta, EE. Her characterization was subtle, nuanced, yet terrifying.
Evil Editor said...Anyeta was terrifying, true, but she was also great in the sack.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...I loved Anyeta, too, Judy...she's so cunning and clever and so
single-minded at the same time. Classic sociopath!
Dave F.
said...It's a throwback to the lurid novels of Poe and that other guy...
Florid in style and with a plot that has lots of ill-at-ease images.
But that's what horror is, in a literary sense.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...That's an interesting perspective, Dave. Though I'd amend it
slightly and say literary horror can be very quiet, too--as in the Turn
of the Screw or anything (practically) by Peter Straub or someone like
Robert Dunbar.
Dave F. said...I can't read Peter Straub. I just
don't have the patience. That being said, I think GHOST STORY is a great
scary movie.
Evil Editor said...I kept thinking of the narrator
as female for several chapters. It's a 1st person/female author thing.
Got over it.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Yes, EE, I know what you mean! I
really love writing from a male perspective--it's even easier to become
the character most of the time...and if you're going to write about
horrific stuff, slipping into a male p.o.v. is the least difficult
thing...
sylvia said...I was somewhat concerned at the start when
I saw that it was a male narrator written by a woman. But it was fine,
from my point of view. (But then, I've noticed that I have a much
greater tolerance for men written by women than women written by men.
Funny that.)
Dave F. said...I noticed that too. Imre is not a
manly man. He's quite different than that. And they seem to be drawn to
disaster and ugliness. More than once I thought "Why don't they just
leave Romania" but of course, that's the nature of tragedy -- the
protagonist can't help but fall.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Yes,
Dave...tragedy can't be adventitious--and story tellers are always
backed up against the wall at some point plotwise--if the hero(s) do the
logical thing, the story ends...LOL
sylvia said...It was darkly disturbing and the incest as a weapon was difficult to read.
Evil Editor said...You'd think Imre would tell Anyeta, hey, that's your daughter and your granddaughter. Pick on someone else.
Lisa_Mannetti said...EE, yes but if Anyeta picked on someone else, the stakes would be a lot lower for Imre...
sylvia
said...I took it that Anyeta was simply evil. Her daughter (and
granddaughter) were easy victims because she had access to them and a
position of trust (the latter one stolen). Imre was a target because he
was affected by what she did to her daughter. She didn't care about Mimi
but she was certainly going to take advantage of anyone who did.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Exactly Sylvia...remind me to consult you as a preliminary reader for my next book!
Dave
F. said...I had trouble with the hallucinations until I figured out
what was happening and why and then every time I got the "huh?" feeling,
I figured it was another vision/hallucination or dream. My
understanding is that Imre now has the power of the "hand of death" as
owner of the box and that Anyeta and Mimi died together.
sylvia said...And my silly question of the month is whether gentling boxes (for horses) existed in reality?
Dave
F. said...I seriously hope no one ever did that to a horse. As much as I
think they are big, smelly beasts, my brother just lost a magnificent
stallion. It's death made me tear up.
Lisa_Mannetti said...S, I'm
going to let you in a big secret: no, gentling boxes never
existed--it's one of the great thrills in my life that readers (and I
include even savvy ones like agents here) can't tell if it's real or
not.
Dave F. said...a cheer from me!
sylvia said...I really wasn't sure.
Robin
S. said...Well, it seemed like something that did exist, so kudos to
you for that! I thought maybe it had been some Dark Ages torture device,
for animals or humans.
Dave F. said...By the way, when I reached
that chapter of Imre with his father and the horses, I knew that
someone had to die that way. After that, I was along for the ride.
Evil Editor said...The gentling of people didn't involve an actual box, right? Is the copper box the gentling box of the title?
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Well, not to confuse boxes, it is referential to the copper box,
but the tools are carried in a special sort of kit which Imre knows
(starting from his childhood) as a gentling box...
Robin S. said...What gave you the idea for your novel, Lisa? Were you always interested in horror?
Kathryn
Magendie said...Lisa, I don't generally read this genre, but I could
very much appreciate the beauty in the writing, the character
development - you do have a gift!
What are you doing now?
Lisa_Mannetti said...Hey Kat! Thanks for coming by and thank you for the compliment!
Evil Editor said...Did Mimi cut off her arm and then the healing power of the hand was used, or was that a hallucination?
Lisa_Mannetti said...No, Mimi definitely cut her arm off, EE...
Evil Editor said...Did she have one arm the rest of the book?
Lisa_Mannetti said...No, EE, Mimi definitely has two arms--she uses the power when she claims the hand to heal herself.
Evil Editor said...Okay. I figured a missing arm would have led to several remarks, so I assumed she had two again.
sylvia
said...Funny, I never doubted that she really cut her arm off. Thinking
about it, it's because at that point, Imre was still looking for
rational explanations for everything and we didn't yet know that he was
seeing a vision for his old flame (I've forgotten her name, Zahara?). So
I trusted his judgement that it was real, because he was so convinced
it couldn't be happening.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Yes, Sylvia, that's correct.
Dave
F. said...That two magic things were involved is almost a necessity. It
gave the story complexity. Anyeta would always have been a witch and
the box was the power that corrupts beyond all reason. The power to see
the future. Wotan gave up an eye, ya know.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Well, I like complexity in stories and I like combining
things...so that said we wind up here with the hand of the dead (which
was actually a wiccan superstition for lighting one's way in a grave
yard, though it was known among gypsies, too) and the gentling.
Dave F. said...The people who claimed the "hand of the dead" all had a scar on their forearms. It is the sign of the box.
Kathryn Magendie said...Does your work give you nightmares? or did the nightmares give you your work or none of above?
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Kat, I think it works both ways, though when I dream about my
work it's not usually a nightmare--it's more like a peak into the story.
That said, I did have a scary gypsy dream after I finished wherein I
was held down captive or something--I figured it was just revenge by a
group that was going to be pissed off at me...LOL
Dave F.
said...I had very little reference to the countryside they lived in.
After a chapter or so, I just gave up and envisioned it as the Bram
Stoker Transylvanian visions and let it go at that. In the end, I didn't
need anything more than that.
Lisa_Mannetti said...Dave, I've
visited a lot of places, but never been to Romania or Hungary beyond a
few seaport towns...research was my key...I love doing it anyhow.
Dave F. said...It is convincingly gypsy. You did a good job with that part of the story.
sylvia said...How did you end up writing about gypsies rather than random witches or fairies or beings from another planet?
Robin S. said...True- gypsies are an interesting departure from the norm.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...I did tons of research on the language, etc...the only other
thing really fudged is the caravan, which is probably a little larger
than it would be in reality.
sylvia said...The caravans actually
morphed into shacks in my mind and then I had to give myself a mental
shake when it became important that they were caravans again.
It came
across that Anyeta was always evil - I suppose because Imre from the
start wanted to stay away. But only at the end did I think that she
embodied the evil having taken the hand, it wasn't really her. On the
other hand, she gave up her secrets, allowing Mimi and the rest to be
trapped. Mimi never did the same although she was under the same thrall.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Always had a thing for gypsies, Syl..for one thing, there were
all those old Lon Chaney movies with Maria Ouspenskya (sp?) and for
another, my mother sort of scared me by telling me not to go to a
certain street and a certain house because gypsies lived there...to this
day, it never dawned on me before that 'gypsies' might have been a
euphemism for something else...LOL...but I do remember whenever we
chanced to drive past the house, there were ragged curtains and it
always scared me. At the same time, I think my mother (and by extension,
me) liked gypsies--she dressed me up as one for Halloween about 3 years
running! (I hardly every outgrew clothes, I'm still only 5 feet tall)
Evil Editor said...You're probably not the shortest person here.
Robin S. said...I measure in at 5'0 myself, Lisa. We're small but mighty. Sylvia is tiny, too.
sylvia
said...(I usually claim I'm 5'0 but as I've stood next to Robin, I
suppose I have to admit that I'm a quarter inch under. *sigh*)
Xiexie said...Also, all these 5' ppls, you'll make me feel like a giant. I'm 6'2"ish.
Lisa_Mannetti said...X, tall people are big in my book...*(what a wretched pun) LOL
Evil Editor said...What would have had to happen for Anyeta to move out of Mimi and into Lenore?
sylvia said...Lenore would have had to take the hand (i.e. cut hers off and claim the power)
Dave
F. said...No, Sylvia, Imre did that. He took the power of the hand.
Mimi had to die for Anyeta to move out of her body. Somehow, the
gentling device prevents that. At the end, Imre has all the power and it
might corrupt him, might not. Anyeta was a true witch capable of
possessing others.
sylvia said...Right but for Anyeta to take Lenore, Lenore would have had to take the hand as well, no?
Dave
F. said...But I got the impression that Mimi wasn't strong enough to
hold off Anyeta for too long. Eventually the old witch would subsume or
(whatever) her mind and then Lenore would be vulnerable.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Yes, Dave...Lenore recognizes that she won't be able to fend off
Anyeta and that Lenore (certainly one of the most trusting characters
in the book) will definitely jump on the copper box bandwagon!
Evil
Editor said...If they had thrown the copper box into Mt. Doom, would
that have made Lenore safe? Of course that would have taken immense will
power.
Lisa_Mannetti said...I'm not sure EE...somehow I don't
think they could throw it away...it's partly compulsion (even without
the lure of the hand itself and its mind-bending games, partly like
being a murder who wants to keep the evidence--but also hide it
(sometimes from fear that they will lose control over the evidence,
sometimes from wanting reminders and trophies) and partly being drawn to
the hand's powers...Anyeta, of course, was very creative in that
department...but I'm not sure it can be thrown away...unless it's passed
on, the person who claims it has all that eternity to face..and that's a
hell of a long time....LOL
sylvia said...You'd have to cut off the arm that was holding the box so everything fell in at once.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Mimi is trying to avoid eternal torment--lying awake and aware
forever--that's for sure...and to do everything to keep herself (and
Imre) away from Lenore...I personally don't think Imre will be corrupted
(though it might make a great sequel)....
Judy said...Sequel! Will there be one?
Lisa_Mannetti said...Judy,I hadn't really considered it, but Dave sort of gave me a great idea...so, you never know!
Dave F. said...What's the idea if you wish to share?
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Imre as corrupted by the hand of the dead...who knows, might get
a nifty little novella out of it, would need more ideas for a whole
book.
Evil Editor said...Dave will give you more ideas. He's got a million of 'em.
Dave
F. said...A Prospero on an island with his good and bad angels. A King
Lear who lost it all (ala Kurasawa's RAN). He is currently Othello (in a
sense). Possibly a MacBeth. That power to see the future through the
eyes of the dead is quite possibly unresistible.
Evil Editor said...See?
Robin S. said...Ha!
Kathryn Magendie said...Just a comment: this is a wonderful idea! :-) Have never been to a chat like this before!
Evil Editor said...We'll expect you to become a regular now, Kat. There's a link to the schedule in the sidebar.
Kathryn Magendie said...Thank you EE- I am going to look for that schedule!
sylvia
said...(I love these book chats. I've started describing them to people
when they question the benefits of "wasting time online")
Robin S. said...(I love 'em too, Sylvia. I think I'm addicted to 'em. EE, don't go anywhere, please.)
Lisa_Mannetti said...Yes, Sylvia, I love writers book chats, too...try writers chat room if you haven't already...
Evil Editor said...Do you now have an agent? Will you submit your next novel to DarkHart?
Lisa_Mannetti
said...No agent now; they are all waiting to jump on the next book,
EE...so must get it done! Probably won't submit to DarkHart--I'd like to
try for a larger venue if I can.
sylvia said...Isn't pretty rare
these days to go straight to a publisher without an agent? Can you talk
about how that came about? It certainly has worked out well!
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Small press is your answer to the "I don't have an agent"
syndrome...anyhow, most agents don't even want to deal with small
presses (not enough money). I did have an agent (a couple in fact) who
was very well known. The first one, told me to junk the book. The second
one sent it around to the New York houses--lots of editors loved it,
but felt it wasn't going to go anywhere because (perennial excuse) the
market was crappy....I sometimes wonder if either agent or any of the
editors know it won the Stoker...talk about vindication--whew!
sylvia said...I bet you feel vindicated! Did the small press do the marketing or did you or a combination?
Lisa_Mannetti
said...I did about 90% of the marketing, Sylvia...which brings me back
to a sudden recall that it made it through the editorial round at one of
the big houses, but the marketing people gave it the chop. LOL I forget
which publisher it was, though.
sylvia said...I suspect the marketing issue is the incest conflict, it's such a hot-button subject.
Robin S. said...Wow, Lisa. That Marketing Dept. story is crummy. But you ended up fine, so there!
Judy said...What are you working on now?
Evil
Editor said...According to the about the author page, she's working on
The Everest Hauntings, which I assume is about an abominable snowman.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Judy, the next book is tentatively titled THE EVEREST HAUNTINGS
but no abominable snowmen (that thought never crossed my mind). It's
about a hypnotherapist who (is afraid of heights, btw) who plans to be
the first person to climb Everest using self-hypnosis. Her goal is to
come back and get on the very lucrative lecture circuit..
Evil Editor said...I'm planning to be the first person to blog from the top of Everest. Just waiting till I have an Ipad.
Kathryn
Magendie said...I will tell you all that Lisa is such a cool woman- met
her at the Pen to Press Writer's Conference in New Orleans - she's full
of energy and ideas and talent and is just a really nice person, to
boot.
Dave F. said...How do you write? anytime you can get? Mornings? away form everything? In the middle of everything?
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Thank you, Kat! Dave, when I'm on track (having been thrown from
same recently due to a bunch of kidney stone attacks and nasty,
unpleasant surgeries) I write every day. My day job is in the evenings,
(usually) I read tarot cards professionally...I was teaching at Mount
Saint Mary and also at SUNY New Paltz, but gave it up when I had to care
for my mother...also there was no time to write while teaching--not
with 300 papers to grade every semester!
Judy said...What do you feel is the difference between "literary horror" and "commercial horror"?
Lisa_Mannetti
said...For me the difference is more a degree of quality...I forget who
said it here, but I'd certainly count Stephen King as literary--and no
one can argue with his financial mega-success. I tend to think of
"commercial" fiction (in any genre) as stuff that's cobbled together for
no other purpose but to make money...the books and stories are
shallow--there aren't going to be reverberations or
echoes--interestingly, there's a lot of true crime that's written as
well as what I'd call literary fiction...starting with Truman Capote's
IN COLD BLOOD, of course.
Evil Editor said...I think Lisa's been more than generous with her time. We should let her go.
Lisa_Mannetti said...I would like to let you all know that in just a few weeks, my macabre gag book,
51 Fiendish Ways to Leave your Lover will be out from Bad Moon Books. Glenn Chadbourne did the illustrations!
Evil Editor said...Tell us one of the 51.
sylvia said...Yeah, what's a random one of the 51 sounds like a good last question :)
Lisa_Mannetti said...Buy her (your soon to be ex-lover) a cemetery plot as her big gift for Valentine's Day...
or
Use his beloved retriever as a living voodoo dog...
You get the idea...
Judy said...LOL!
Lisa_Mannetti
said...Glenn's illos really make it pop...for anyone who doesn't know
his work, check Doug Cleggt's ISIS and Stephen King's SECRETARY OF
DREAMS, for starters...
Evil Editor said...It sounds like a perfect Valentine's Day gift.
Lisa_Mannetti
said...I'm hoping BAD MOON gets it out in time for Valentine's Day...
they should...it's very close to done--nothing left but the back cover.
(Which may be done, for all I know, even as we speak). I don't have the
ISBN memorized, but it should show up fairly soon on the Bad Moon Books
site and of course Amazon, etc...
sylvia said...I'll definitely keep an eye out for it!
Lisa_Mannetti said...Well, thank you all and happy reading, happy writing!!